Saturn in Leo Father

different times ... different approaches

If this is your second Saturn Return, you were born shortly after the end of World War II. Your father may have been wounded emotionally and physically or crippled intellectually and materially as a result.

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The eleven articles in the Saturn in Leo series:

Degree of Saturn in Leo and Dates of Return
Who Says I am not Born under the Special Protection of God? Saturn in Leo: Leos feel very special. They feel talented and chosen. This article presents a discussion of the basic issues for Saturn in Leo with examples from the lives of famous people you can learn from. How did Lawrence of Arabia handle Saturn in Leo? Charlie Chaplin? Hitler? How are you going to handle it? By the way, do you know whose quote that is, "Who says I am not born under the special protection of God?"
You Think Some Great Power Failed You Saturn in Leo in the 10th House: Sample reading for a young man with Saturn in Leo in the 10th house who trained for years for the priesthood only to discover that he was an atheist. Or so he thought. My answer may surprise you.
Brush up on Your Solar Gods and Heroes This article gives you some inspiration as it explores the symbols associated with the expression of Leo and the Sun in the astrology chart. These are the things to which Saturn in Leo most aspires.
Your second Saturn Return in Leo Saturn in Leo. Born between 1946-48? Turning 60 soon? So are the countries India, Pakistan, Israel and Palestine. Does this tell you something? Pakistan has been in the news lately. It is becoming the darling of American foreign policy. Read more. Yours is the generation that came into the world on the defensive, fighting for your life, just like these countries.
Saturn in Leo in History This article highlights events that occurred when Saturn was in Leo all the way back to 0 CE, many having to do with the Middle East. The countries of Pakistan, India, Palestine and Israel are now experiencing their second Saturn Returns.
When It's Time to Create a Better God Creativity is a big issues with Saturn in Leo. Although this concept may sound strange, considered symbolically, this is one of the most pressing necessities for those with Saturn in Leo,to keep evolving their concept of deity until they get to something they can honestly worship! . Read about Carlos, the Mexican airline pilot, Alexandra the scientist and others who take this personal journey. These are true life stories with the names changed to protect privacy.
Genesis -- Don't Leave Home without It Saturn in Leo. Find out what the story of creation can do for you in your personal journey!
When Blessings Turn to Curses Saturn in Leo. This is a very special area of interest for those with Saturn in Leo ... what do you do when there's too much of a good thing? So many of the Saturn in Leo people I read for have so much talent it almost becomes a burden. Are you one of these?
Frankenstein, a very special myth for those born with Saturn in Leo. Frankenstein is the creature, the created, who figures out he is ugly and turns on his Creator. Do you get it? Read a complete discussion for some core Saturn in Leo issues.
Quotes and Icons for the Saturn in Leo kids!

We are used to the darks forces of the subconscious by now but to our fathers (I was born in 1944) it came as a disillusioning and devastating blow that embittered some and turned others to self destruction. Many families suffered from men who returned from the war with their humanity and compassion eroded.

If this is your first Saturn Return, many were born in 1973-75 to Viet Nam Vets, a particularly bitter and disenfranchised group of young men returning not to a hero's welcome but to disparaging comments or sneers in a divided country.

The other kind of father might be typified by the myth of Daedalus, an incredibly talented craftsman who does not want the competition of a son.

One 59 year old woman with Saturn in Leo said, "My father, Patrick, is an abuser, very controlling. I am never good enough. He may have physically abused me when I was around 8 years old. And he continues to abuse me emotionally. Has sent nasty letters, my entire life, telling me how I have ruined my life. Sends unflattering photos and tells me to lose weight. He tried to kill himself, twice after WWII and I may have been conceived in a military mental hospital in Xxx, shortly thereafter for sure. He is very talented, music, art, sailing, dentist, finances and charming ... and in private a tyrant."

For those born in Germany, Austria, Italy and Japan, the ravages of war are coupled with the bitterness of defeat. Georg describes his father this way. "My father was the village Latin teacher. He felt the war ruined his life and he remained bitter until the end of his days."

Paula writes, "My father loved the war. He was an officer in Belgium and enjoyed military life. At one time he had wanted to make it his career. He wasn't particularly thrilled to come home to the family he'd created. And to us, he was a stranger."

Semiramis Appiaramo talks at length about her dad.

"I was born towards the end of the war. My parents met and married right before my father shipped out.

"I think both sets of parents were horrified. My dad’s grandmother never really accepted my mom. My mom’s family worried my dad would never amount to anything; they had a job for him lined up after the war (when jobs were scarce) at a local filling station. Instead he went to MIT.

"You’d be worried too if your kids married under such circumstances. So there were problems with that from the very beginning.

"Dad never bonded with me. He bonded well with my little sister, born in 1950. He didn’t meet me till I was 2. I adored him, and he adored me, but still I know it wasn’t the same as being with a baby from the beginning.

"I remember just a couple of things. Mom said he tried to order me around like a soldier, like to go take a nap, and of course I didn’t follow orders. She said I kept getting out of bed and coming back downstairs and he "didn't know what to do." What do you do with a little person who doesn't take orders???

"My dad never talked to me about the war. Once in the car I asked him about it and for some reason I said, “Did you die in the war?” I was just a kid. He became FURIOUS. That I remember well. I thought he was going to hit me. "Don't ever say that," he said.

"Who knows what it would’ve been like without the war. I think it forced a lot on him … it was fairly common to marry and get the woman pregnant, you know, in the face of your own death. And then whatever went on overseas, I’m sure they had other women, saw death, thought a lot, wondered where God was ... He was in the artillery, which I would think would be less front-line that the foot soldiers? He returned to a lot of responsibility and a woman he didn’t know. Every marriage is like that … after the honeymoon ... but let that pass.

"I asked him when he was dying if there was anything about the war he wanted to talk about and he said “no”.

'With problems in the family, he never understood. He would ask me why my brother was doing this and such. Like many dads of that generation, he wasn’t emotionally present. He despised shows of emotion and was stoic himself. Maybe it was all he had to stuff down in the war.

"I’ve talked to men my age who were in Vietnam, and they can hardly talk about it. One man told me he had nightmares for years. Maybe my dad was. My mom never talked about it either. I asked her about the war when I was I college, from a historical standpoint. She said, “I don’t know anything. I was washing diapers by hand and hanging them on the clothesline.” She mentioned it was hard to get sugar. There was rationing.

"I’m sure it affected him, but I don’t know how. I’m one of those who believes everything affects us, and if you change one thing, it all turns out differently. His life would’ve been different, too, if he’d been 6’1” tall, or if he’d been dumb.

"He was an alcoholic, though a high-functioning one, and a chain-smoker. A lot of young men picked up those habits in the war. He didn't deal with his emotions; he drank. He had great camaraderie with men. I think he got that from the war.

"He loved life and I know he had some happy times. He retained his religious faith. My friend who was in Vietnam said he couldn’t stay a Catholic after the war, but he’s still very spiritual, if you know what I mean.

"I’m 60 now. I’ve had traumatic things happen. If someone asked me how they’d changed me, I’d say “I was never the same afterwards.” My traumas have made me a better person. Perhaps his did too, and those other things were there to begin with. I never got the idea he was traumatized. I know this because I worked with the homeless, and many of them were Vietnam vets who were addicts and psychologically disturbed, unable to work or have relationships. They were visibly anxious (post-traumatic stress syndrome) and my dad was never that. He ate responsibility for breakfast, and then had some more for lunch. He was more cerebral than emotional.

"One day I walked in and my dad was listening to “Eroica” , Beethoven. He told me what courage it took for Beethoven to go on living when he’d lost his ability to hear and music was his life. He wrote me later that he hated Tchaikovsky, and “Pathetique.” He thought they were whiny. One time he talked about the "winos' on "Skid Row" downtown. He said he couldn't understand how someone could give up like that, or how someone could be suicidal. He liked the spirit of Beethoven, and I think that’s the way he was. He got on with his life after the war, and he went on to other battles. He may have found other things harder than the war. He got the good out of it, in other words. He was proud he’d served, he respected the military, he thought his country and its laws were the best, and he fully participated in it all. He was one helluva guy!"

I haven't spoken to my father in over two years. Before that it wasn't much of a relationship either except he did pay my mother a ton of child support and alimony, and put me all the way through graduate school. I'm sure I "cost him" nearly half a million.

He was drafted to Vietnam right after I was born. He was just out of residency - medical school - and went over there as a physician. I know he saw all the action,the worst part of it, and he's sensitive. He's Italian. Very emotional. When he came back, my mom says he was shell-shocked. I think they'd call it PTSS nowadays. One time he was walking down the street with my mom and a car backfaired, and he dived into a cellar stairway in one second. My mom said she just laughed at him. When he came back, Mom said he had nightmares and night sweats. Also he had back trouble. When he was in Vietnam they started getting shelled and he dived off the jeep, ducking for cover, and he hit the ground wrong on his back. He has a lot of trouble now with his back (he's 63) and is in constant pain. It's affecting his legs and arms now too.

When he came back from Vietnam, they got divorced. My mom got custody. For a while he would come get me for visits. He flew in in his own airplane and it was exciting. I remember that. He told me when I was 6, I talked about the clouds when we were up in the sky. Then he didn't come get me much. He said my mother made it impossible. My mother says he didn't care.

My mother was hostile and bitter about the whole thing. I know I have an unfair and probably unrealistic attitude toward my father, having to hear about him from my mother all the time, and not good things, but I have no feelings for him at all. If he's different from what she says, he never let me know him enough to find out. It just hasn't worked out. You can't say it wouldn't have happened without the war, but I do know he wouldn't have the back trouble he has now. Also he didn't marry again. Maybe marriage wasn't for him.

It's kind of unfinished business in my life. I've seen him in his doctor role and he seems like a sweet man, but it just isn't there for me. I guess you'd say I didn't really have a father. The war was devastating for our family. It didn't exist after that.

-- Maria, born with Saturn in Leo .

If you have an experience you would like to share with others of your generation, please email me and I will post them here anonymously or with credit as you wish.

The Myth of Daedalus and Icarus

The myth of Icarus supplies a look at a different kind of Saturn in Leo father, one whose jealousy costs two young boys their life.

Icarus, as you remember, tried to fly but flew too close to the sun. The wax holding his wings melted and he plummeted to his death. But who put him up to this? His own father.

As a friend of mine once said, a Greek scholar, "What would you do if you found your husband down at the beach doing this with your son?"

TELEVISION SERIES

When God created recess he made the Saturn in Leo kids stay in and write "I am a loving child of a Harsh Dictator God" 20 times on the blackboard.
Ouch! Sad but true.

Other Saturn in Leo themes emerging ...

When blessings become a curse ..

The need to create a better God ...

Responses to Saturn in Leo mini readings - CLICK HERE

Here is another artist's rendering of Daedalus pushing Icarus off the edge of a cliff, "Fly, Icarus, fly!"

Now its time to find out the whole story, the myth as told by Thomas Bullfinch (now in the public domain).

DAEDALUS & ICARUS

The labyrinth from which Theseus escaped by means of the clue of Ariadne was built by Daedalus, a most skilful artificer. It was an edifice with numberless winding passages and turnings opening into one another, and seeming to have neither beginning nor end, like the river Maeander, which returns on itself, and flows now onward, now backward, in its course to the sea.

Theseus and the Minotaur in Daedalus' labyrinth

Daedalus built the labyrinth for King Minos, but afterwards lost the favour of the king, and was shut up in a tower. He contrived to make his escape from his prison, but could not leave the island by sea, as the king kept strict watch on all the vessels, and permitted none to sail without being carefully searched.

"Minos may control the land and sea," said Daedalus, "but not the regions of the air. I will try that way." So he set to work to fabricate wings for himself and his young son Icarus. He wrought feathers together, beginning with the smallest and adding larger, so as to form an increasing surface. The larger ones he secured with thread and the smaller with wax, and gave the whole a gentle curvature like the wings of a bird.

Icarus, the boy, stood and looked on, sometimes running to gather up the feathers which the wind had blown away, and then handling the wax and working it over with his fingers, by his play impeding his father in his labours. When at last the work was done, the artist, waving his wings, found himself buoyed upward, and hung suspended, poising himself on the beaten air. He next equipped his son in the same manner and taught him how to fly, as a bird tempts her young ones from the lofty nest into the air. When all was prepared for flight he said, "Icarus, my son, I charge you to keep at a moderate height, for if you fly too low the damp will clog your wings, and if too high the heat will melt them. Keep near me and you will be safe."

While he gave him these instructions and fitted the wings to his shoulders, the face of the father was wet with tears, and his hands trembled. He kissed the boy, not knowing that it was for the last time. Then rising on his wings, he flew off, encouraging him to follow, and looked back from his own flight to see how his son managed his wings. As they flew the ploughman stopped his work to gaze, and the shepherd leaned on his staff and watched them, astonished at the sight, and thinking they were gods who could thus cleave the air. They passed Samos and Delos on the left and Lebynthos on the right, when the boy, exulting in his career, began to leave the guidance of his companion and soar upward as if to reach heaven. The nearness of the blazing sun softened the wax which held the feathers together, and they came off. He fluttered with his arms, but no feathers remained to hold the air.

While his mouth uttered cries to his father it was submerged in the blue waters of the sea which thenceforth was called by his name. His father cried, "Icarus, Icarus, where are you?" At last he saw the feathers floating on the water, and bitterly lamenting his own arts, he buried the body and called the land Icaria in memory of his child. Daedalus arrived safe in Sicily, where he built a temple to Apollo, and hung up his wings, an offering to the god.

Daedalus was so proud of his achievements that he could not bear the idea of a rival. His sister had placed her son Perdix under his charge to be taught the mechanical arts. He was an apt scholar and gave striking evidences of ingenuity. Walking on the seashore he picked up the spine of a fish. Imitating it, he took a piece of iron and notched it on the edge, and thus invented the saw. He, put two pieces of iron together, connecting them at one end with a rivet, and sharpening the other ends, and made a pair of compasses. Daedalus was so envious of his nephew's performances that he took an opportunity, when they were together one day on the top of a high tower to push him off. But Minerva (Athena), who favors ingenuity, saw him falling, and arrested his fate by changing him into a bird called after his name, the Partridge. This bird does not build his nest in the trees, nor take lofty flights, but nestles in the hedges, and mindful of his fall, avoids high places.

one of my favorite all time paintings

Other famous paintings

Icarus by Matisse
Icarus by Nizovtzev
Icarus Landing by Newberry

Perhaps this description of a father and son stirs feelings in you that are uncomfortable and a healing process will begin. What motivates fathers to endanger their children? What motivates them to force their children into living our their dreams? What price do children pay for the mistakes of their fathers?

These are all issues of importance to those born with Saturn in Leo. I would love to tell your story anonymously (or with credit) if you have one that fits this theme and were born with Saturn in Leo. Please EMAIL ME. The purpose of this page is not to be unfair to fathers and their tremendous responsibilities but rather to share experiences and insights that may produce a common thread.

With Saturn in Cancer, we explored the father-hunger that resulted from a deep wounding in the family. With Saturn in Leo, we have a tremendously talented father who has somehow gone astray. He may bitterly nurse grievances that he couldn't pursue his talents or he may force his own talents (and fate) onto his children where they become not a gift but a burden.

Pilar is a vivacious, engaging 58-60 year old woman who describes her father this way: My father died when I was living in Xxx, but I was able to be with him shortly before he died. He and I were very close at different times, especially after I got out of high school. I think of him as one of 3 people who I knew really loved me in my life. He was a major figure in my life and it's been only after his death that I realized (admitted) the problems and flaws : depression, alcoholism, womanizing, abusive to my mother.... Pila's father left her with a blessing which has become a curse. In a letter to her he wrote, "Stick with your painting -- it is your forte."

Pila is more interested in being a housewife than a painter yet she tortures herself regularly with expensive and time consuming art classes. She does not appear to have any talent. She really believes that it is her wish to do this and that she is extremely talented and yet to an outsider it is fairly obvious Pilar is a puppet dancing on a string.

The Saturn in Leo father is likely to be charismatic as well as talented and whatever he pronounces, whatever he speaks over your cradle, so to speak, will be hard to escape as fate.

The redemption of the wounded father is set forth in The Grail Quest. CLICK HERE to learn more about the Grail Quest in relation to Saturn in Leo.

Here are some more examples from those with Saturn in Leo.

This is written by a 29 year old girl: I work for my father, with whom I have always been very close. He is a licensed master xxx of 35 years. I handle the office matters, which is a complete bore. I am fascinated by his knowledge and skill and wish to attain the same and also the passion he has for what he does.

Here is a father who has imprisoned his daughter not just with a blessing but with physical bondage. Clearly this girl loves and admires her father at the same time that she resents being engaged at his will.

Also ...

Saturn Return in Cancer series

What about Your Second Saturn Return?
Your second Saturn Return takes place between the ages of 56 and 60. Learn more about this important time in your life ... something to look forward to, something to look back on.

Old Men are Bastards
This article discusses the chart of Robert McNamara who is currently experiencing his third Saturn Return.

Saturn in Leo Series

You Think Some Great Power Failed You
Reply to a young man with Saturn in Leo in the 10th house who spent years preparing for the ministry only to find out he was an atheist. Or so he thought. The answer may surprise you.

Saturn in Leo in History

Saturn in Leo in the Tenth House

Saturn in Leo: Create a Better God

Saturn in Leo : Genesis (Don't Leave Home without It)

Saturn in Leo : When a Blessing becomes a Curse

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READ COMMENTS FROM FREE MINI-SATURN RETURN READINGS NANCY HAS DONE, THEN EMAIL FOR YOURS.

Nancy R. Fenn is America's Saturn Return expert.
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This page is dedicated to the man who was my father while my real father was away in the war, John Trimble Hale.

Rockdale, Texas 1945